The Kitchen Cleanliness Spectrum

Welcome to SALT PIG! Where are we on the kitchen cleanliness spectrum? And what actually matters when it comes to keeping the germs at bay? We discuss gloves in the kitchen, festering sponges, dishes in the sink, the folly of designating dishtowels for different purposes, and more. We get deep into Ellie’s scarcity mindset and Lukas’ performative cleaning. Plus when you love a cutting board, (how to) treat it well.

Discussed in this episode:

• How Black Gloves Took Over Cooking Videos (via Eater)
• Sweetbitter by Stephanie Danler
• Ikea kitchen towels
• Submerging wood cutting boards in mineral oil (via Reddit)
• The Garlic Powder Bias (via Ellie)

Instagram | Substack

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Welcome to Salt Pig, where two cookbook writers chat about the ups and downs of actual home kitchen life. What are we talking about this week, Lucas?

SPEAKER_00 0:11

This week we are talking about um kind of like kitchen cleanliness. We kind of develop a theory that what the relationship that you have with your kitchen towels really might say might say something about who you are as a person. Is a sponge ever clean? What's the proper way to clean a cutting board? We go, you know, we it's a kind of a broad conversation about kitchen organization and kitchen cleaning.

SPEAKER_01 0:35

And very illuminating. I'm I feel a little self-conscious after this conversation. You can find new and old episodes wherever you listen to podcasts, and check us out on Substack at saltpig.substack.com where you can sign up for our monthly newsletter, The Chomp. All right, let's get started.

SPEAKER_00 0:58

All right, so last episode we talked about juicing citrus and how you use your hands and squeeze the citrus juice through your fingers, and which is something that I have done too when I haven't had one of my citrus juicers. And we talked about how, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:13

I was gonna say, yeah, and I was like, is after we recorded that, I was like, is that really gross? Because I really I was like, I just do it automatically, and I do do it behind the scenes, but I was like, gosh, is that like and I sort of stand by it, but I was like, is it gross? Is the whole is our whole salt pig community gonna be like yuck?

SPEAKER_00 1:34

Well, that's where like my father-in-law one time I was cooking for them and he watched me do that and it's like, Do you do you want a citrus juicer? And I don't know, it's it is the same. I'm kind of the same where I'm like, I don't think twice about it.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

I was actually thinking of Einegarden because I was in addition to maybe squeezing with her hands, she also has like the most contraptions for squeezing citrus like in the world. I feel like she has like an actual machine that does it where she's oh the big tall one for the or no, like this, like a like one that you have to like plug in that like is like Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right. And I was like, I can't imagine what it takes to clean that thing. I was I was like, if if this is the cross I have to bear with doing it with my hands, I was like, I I'll do that over the huge machine.

SPEAKER_00 2:19

I I would bet that she only brings that out when she's making like orange juice or lemonade.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

But yeah, maybe maybe not.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

Maybe maybe she has some help with the cleanup too.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

That that would make a big difference. I would clean entirely differently. I mean, cook entirely differently if I had someone else cleaning up.

SPEAKER_00 2:34

I had um our neighbors come up for a little brunchy moment earlier last weekend. And you know how sometimes you're cooking for people who you become like aware of not having washed your hands recent as often enough? Or it's and it's like one of those things that when I'm just cooking for myself, I really don't think about it.

SPEAKER_01 2:55

Right.

SPEAKER_00 2:55

But like when you're a very clean person. I am, I know it, you know, and like but I'm gonna handle everything. Right. But then when everybody's watching you and you're like slicing the bread and like cracking the eggs and doing all this stuff. And then I'm like, oh actually let me stop now. I'm gonna wash my hands and then I'm gonna stop and like every time I got up from the table to like grab, you know, more slice more bread or whatever, wash my hands first. I felt much more aware of my hand washing than I normally do.

SPEAKER_01 3:24

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I love when people are like gathered around the kitchen and you're all sort of chit-chatting and drinking a glass of wine and I'm like, you know, putting finishing touches on dinner. Like, I love that, but there is a certain performance that you know you're putting on. Like certain people might be picking up certain details about what you're doing, and you're like, gotta gotta sort of kind of like clamps things up a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

Yeah, it does. But have you noticed too? I don't know, you probably don't watch as much like Instagram and TikTok as I do, but there's this thing with like the black vinyl gloves. Like all these influencers put on these black rubber gloves to do their like all their vegetable prep. And all the people it's not even like just handling meat, it's everything. I know is this what people are people actually doing this, like throwing away a whole pair of disposable gloves every time they chop up vegetables or handle chicken breasts or something?

SPEAKER_01 4:12

I am so glad you brought that up. It's been a real thing that I've noticed that really grates on my nerves, because I'm like, it's sort of like like during COVID when people would wear masks and they'd wear them like, you know, not properly. It was it was the same idea where I'm like, just because someone's wearing gloves doesn't mean that they're being more sanitary. No. Like their gloves could be filthy.

SPEAKER_00 4:35

Completely.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

I was at Costco at some point, and they, you know, have brought the samples back now post-COVID, and I have my kids with me, which is very unusual, and they were really excited because there were all these samples, so they were going around trying everything. And there was this very kind old lady who was in charge of one of the samples that involved raw chicken. And she was using she had gloves on, and she was using her gloves to sort of manipulate this raw chicken and like put it in this little toaster oven or something, and then she was using those same glove tans to like do some other stuff afterwards, and I literally like had to pull the food out of my children's hands. I was like, I really don't want you to get salmonella, like I really don't. But it was really hard because they were like grabbing it and then like immediately wanting to pop. I was like, just hold on for a second. Like because I was like, This is gloves, yes, she's wearing gloves, but I was like, those gloves are dirty, and I was like, you can't just like put on gloves and then be like have a free-for-all. I think it's so strange that people on these videos are using gloves at home. Like, I'll use gloves. I think the only time I've ever used gloves in my house is when I'm making hot sauce and I feel like when you're like pulling all the seeds and membranes and doing all that stuff, and I'm like, I've you make that mistake once of not wearing the gloves. Yes, I've made that mistake once when handling chilies, I will never ever make it again. But like other than that, I'm like, gloves are crazy. And who's buying like where do you even buy gloves? I guess you could probably buy it.

SPEAKER_00 6:06

Oh, you find that they're actually very easy to find because every time I've done like a cooking demonstration or uh or something, I end up having a box of gloves because I don't want people to be freaked out. And then because of exactly what you're saying, I'm like, well, are people aware that like I just handled this with the gloves and I'm or or do they think that because there's gloves on it's standard? So I end up going through so many gloves in a performative way. Yes. Uh just to sort of give some false sense of comfort about how sanitary my cooking is and that it's in that situation.

SPEAKER_01 6:37

Right. I find it so weird. I mean, like, for example, I don't love handling raw chicken. But like, who does love handling raw chicken? It's not not great. I'm like, wearing gloves, yeah, does it give you some sort of it probably sort of dulls the sensation of handling raw chicken, but I'm like, this is sort of the price I have to pay for cooking chicken.

SPEAKER_00 6:56

Like completely.

SPEAKER_01 6:57

It just seems crazy to wear gloves to like, I don't know, smoosh some chicken around in a marinade or yeah, or take it out of the packaging or or any of it.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

It's very, very I think it's very, very weird. And I mean, I'm not like uh, you know I I care about the environment. I don't feel like I'm like talking about the environment all the time, but I'm like, it also just seems crazy. I'm like, just wash your hands completely. Your hands are dirty.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

Soap is very effective.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

Yeah, very effective. And it rinses all the stuff away, and then you don't just have this like garbage bag full of used chicken y gloves. Gloves, yeah. I think it's very odd. But yeah, it is it there, I do feel like it also encourages this idea when people see videos of everyone wearing gloves, then it's just like anything else. Then people are like, oh, am I supposed to be wearing gloves when I'm like cutting up a pepper?

SPEAKER_00 7:50

It just I know, I know, I know. More disposable crap is just like such a bad thing.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

It is, it really is. But it is, it does bring up the idea of like how how dirty is too dirty.

SPEAKER_02 8:04

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 8:05

And like what I mean, obviously you want to have a clean kitchen. Obviously, nobody wants to get sick, and food handling and sanitariness is extremely important in the kitchen. So that that was sort of the kernel of today's show, which is like how how clean is your kitchen? I'm curious. How clean is my kitchen? I'm kind of curious. Because again, when I was thinking about the lemons, I was like, oh, maybe I'm secretly really dirty. Um, so I wanted to sort of get into some details.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

Uh how clean is my kitchen. Yeah. I would say I feel like I do almost every night a semi-deep clean, which is to say, I want I just want to go to bed with a kitchen clean. I hate waking up and there being clutter and there being dishes in the sink.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

I want everything Me too. There cannot be dishes in the sink. That is a hundred percent.

SPEAKER_00 8:55

It actually makes me mad in the morning if when I wake up and see them there. It's just it's the wrong way to start the day.

SPEAKER_01 9:00

Yeah. Yeah. Dishes that have been soaking all night are just disgusting. They are just really terrible. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

Yeah. And then like putting your hands in that water.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

I mean, it's like been chilling all night with all this gross stuff. It's yucky. But like what sort of clean are you doing? Obviously, so you're putting dishes in the dishwasher, you're cleaning all your pans.

SPEAKER_00 9:18

Mm-hmm. And then I do a spray down with like uh yeah. I do a spray down. I don't actually use like an antibacterial one or like a all-purpose cleaning spray. We have like marble countertops right now, which are kind of high maintenance.

SPEAKER_02 9:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:36

And so I have a special thing for like a special cleaner for the marble.

SPEAKER_02 9:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

But I sometimes, if there is, if I feel like, yeah, like chicken juice splattered around, or if if there was food that I wouldn't want to sit out, or might like be a bacterial breeding ground, then I do get out like an all-purpose sort of cleaning spray thing. But um, I don't do that every day. I it's more like a soap and sponge, sort of scrub down, wipe dry, and then like this marble cleaning spray. I don't what do you do?

SPEAKER_01 10:05

I do like a s a sponge down or like a wipe down with a dishcloth. And I don't use any spray. And sometimes I'm like, should I be spraying all this down? Because it does seem like that would be really nice. It's just like one, it's one extra step that I'm like, is just water and good old dish soap enough?

SPEAKER_00 10:28

Well, let me ask you, do you have a dedicated countertop sponge that's different from the dish scrubbing sponge?

SPEAKER_01 10:35

No.

SPEAKER_00 10:36

Me neither.

SPEAKER_01 10:38

Oh good, oh good. I was like, whoa.

SPEAKER_00 10:40

Um But there are people who do, and they might be some of the same people that use rubber gloves when they're gonna be able to do it. It might be.

SPEAKER_01 10:47

But this is, yeah, I don't do that. And I do, and sponges are tricky. And I've had all sorts of weird systems where I've like, I've tried to do it. When is a sponge ever clean? It's never clean. It's never clean. And I've tried like putting it through the dishwasher. They say that works, and then like I think at some point people said like you could microwave it and like disinfect it and all this stuff. And like uh and I've tried to just say I'm not using sponges anymore, and then I use like cloths and you know, these like Swedish things.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Scrubber thingies.

SPEAKER_01 11:18

Yeah. What are the scrubber thingies?

SPEAKER_00 11:20

Like um, I can't remember what they're called, but it's like a little pad that's like a it's cloth, but you can kind of go in there and like scrub a pan with it, and then you just throw it in the wash. They're pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 11:31

Oh, that sounds good. My sister's really into just using like a cloth, like a rag almost that and sh there are these sort of special ones, and I tried using them, and I just there's something about like I don't have a good place to sort of hang them so they dry, so then it just sits in the p a pile, and that I can't abide.

SPEAKER_00 11:50

Like there's Oh god, yeah. I had a I wipe did a wipe down like soapy whole countertop situation, and it was like an old IKEA rag that had, you know, the the holes and was kind of like barely still a rectangle. And um and then I just waded it up and threw it in the sink when I was done. And that thing sat in the sink for at least four days before I was willing to like move it into the dirty clothes hamper because I just didn't want to touch it. And while I was in the sink, it was like festering and you're like dumping stuff in the sink that's like being you know, it's getting flushed through all this other crap. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:29

The sponge situation. I'm back to just having sponges and then just being like, I'm just gonna replace them maybe more often than I would. But but that does bring up my favorite kitchen sort of sanitary issue, which is kitchen towels. And this I the reason I wanted to bring this up is because it's been a real sore spot for Tom and I. It's taken we've been married now for like, gosh, I don't know, twelve almost twelve years, and this has probably been like one of the bigger conflicts that we've had is like kitchen towels. Like what how how do we handle them? And this is an issue that only I am bringing up. It's obviously clear. Um, but Tom just wants to use a dish towel for whatever. He's just like, there's a dish towel, I want to like wipe a counter with it, I wanna, you know, dry a dish with it, I wanna dry off my hands, whatever. And I'm like, that that grosses me out. I'm like yes. So I'm so curious to hear what you do. So my thing, and I it makes me feel sort of like I'm a crazy person, but I'm like, there's a dish towel that sits on the edge of the sink that's like for dirty jobs. So, like, oh, you spill some orange juice on the floor, use this dish towel. Or, oh, you need to wipe off a counter that has like some crumbs and other schmutz on it, use this towel.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

But if you're like a floor-touching towel, there's a kitchen a countertop touching towel.

SPEAKER_01 13:55

Well, I guess the countertop and the floor, I mean, to be honest, if someone spills something on the floor, I kind of want to be like, use a paper towel.

SPEAKER_00 14:01

But or use a towel and then put it directly into the hamper.

SPEAKER_01 14:05

Right, right. But I guess I'm like, I'm fine with I be I basically I just want a towel that's clean for me to dry my hands on. Because I'm like, I am actually kind of fastidious about having clean hands. So I'm like, if I've gone to the trouble of cleaning my hands, I want to have a clean towel to dry them on, and that's not a towel that's like been used to wipe up orange juice or you know, is full of crumbs or jam or raw egg or whatever. So that towel, the clean towel, is the one that's like on the oven and the dirty towel is the one that's on the sink.

SPEAKER_00 14:40

Yeah. And and it's very clear in your mind which is which.

SPEAKER_01 14:44

Ver crystal clear. Like, I wouldn't touch that sink towel with my clean hands like if you paid me. But like no one else, I realized I had never clued the children into this system until actually just this morning. They were like, Oh, can you hand me a towel or something else like making breakfast? And I was like, Oh, are you cleaning that up? Like, it's this towel, and they were like, Mom, what are you talking about? And I'll tell you, it's a towel. Yeah, exactly. So I was like, I'm crazy. I don't know what to tell you guys, but um but yeah, how do you handle that? Because I do feel like a towel gets really dirty, and then I don't want to wipe my hands on it.

SPEAKER_00 15:19

Well, I was just thinking as you were saying that when I used to work in uh restaurant kitchens, it is crazy like uh did you ever read bittersweet?

SPEAKER_01 15:28

Yes, I was just about to say that.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

She has the greatest passage in there about um like bar mops.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Is that like the restaurant in the restaurant lingos?

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Basically, there's some kind of laundry service that delivers a giant like cube of kit clean towels every week. Yeah, and then the dirty ones pile up. And um and the way they get doled out is as if this these are like truffles or it's not some kind of like very high value thing because like there's such there's a fixed number of them.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

Yes, you only get like two a shift or something.

SPEAKER_00 16:02

People stash them in different places throughout the restaurant restaurant where other people don't know that where they are.

SPEAKER_01 16:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

And for some reason, there's like a total scarcity mindset about these bar mops or just the kitchen towels in the kitchen. And so it was always such a stress trying to like find the clean towels. And then because you're working in these kitchens where you're just like the scale and there's so much food and there's so much going on, they get filthy almost immediately. Yes. And not just filthy, but like sopping. They're like stained, they're like they get so gross so fast. Yeah. And I'm like, why is there not just an endless supply of these in a restaurant kitchen? I don't understand that. I I I I would love for anybody who can explain that to me who's like run a restaurant or owned a restaurant. I would love to know why. I have no idea.

SPEAKER_01 16:52

It seems like it I mean, but I'm gonna say yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Well, I'm just gonna say, like, in my house, I have gone to IKEA and bought those like 10 packs of the kitchen towels. Maybe I there's at least 150 towels. Like I treat them, I there's no shortage, there's no scarcity mindset with these towels. And like it's in some way, it's like the most luxurious thing that you want a clean towel, reach into that drawer. It's full of clean towels. Take as many as you want. When you're done, put them in the hamper. We don't have to think about it again. It's like an immediate they're constantly getting refreshed.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

See, that's that's my problem, is that I have scarcity mindset in all things. So I'm like, we're we're gonna clean the towels when they're really dirty. But I'm like, are they really dirty yet? Could they be a little dirtier? Like, yeah, yeah, we could keep the towels around. But I'm like, that's why I want to keep my my hand drying towel clean. Because I'm like, if it's gonna stick around for like more than a day, I guess I want to still guarantee that it's clean. But I should just I have a full drawer of towels.

SPEAKER_00 17:57

I should just be I feel like this is an opportunity. This is an opportunity for growth. Lean in, live the life of towel abundance and just like when you dry your hands, just put it straight in the hamper. Gotcha. Change it out.

SPEAKER_01 18:10

That would be life-changing. That would life. It's great.

SPEAKER_00 18:12

And it's like better than I don't know, I go to people's houses and they just go through paper towels that way because they don't want to use uh they don't want to have to wash a kitchen towel.

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Right.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

And that's so much worse. Why not just like do a load of kitchen towels once a week?

SPEAKER_01 18:26

No, you're you're so right.

SPEAKER_00 18:28

There's a podcast on Poog with Kate Berlant and Jaclyn Novak. Um and they it's it's Poog, which is goop spelled backwards. So in some ways it's a little bit of like a send-up of like, well, but it's also like a full endorsement of the people who are completely in that world too. Yes, but they have a theory that you're one of two types of people. When you get, say, like a really nice candle or like a nice moisturizer or a nice like lotion or something, like nice hand lotion, you're either the person who's gonna start using it right away and like just kind of savor it then, or you're the type of person who's going to never open it because there's never an opportunity that is like that really merits the occasion. Yes. Are you more of the lack of it?

SPEAKER_01 19:10

I am definitely that second person. I have a lot of hands, nice hand lotions that people have given me, and I'm still like, oh, I'll just use this like shitty hotel lotion that you know, like the bottle's actually sort of empty, but I can like I can get a little tiny bit more out of it.

SPEAKER_00 19:26

Let me grab the scissors and crack that one open. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 19:30

Exactly. Which wait, so which one are you?

SPEAKER_00 19:33

I think I'm the first one. Are you? I feel like too often things will like go to waste, you know, like especially when people have given me like really nice food things, and if I like forget about it and it goes bad, I feel like so much worse. So I'm just now I just try to I try to create some occasion around it so it's not just like a random Tuesday, but like I want to make sure that it gets used.

SPEAKER_01 19:55

Yeah. I need to get better about that. It is a scarcity mindset, and it's just kind of silly because it's it's not really again, like I have a drawer full of kitchen towels, so like I'm just keeping them there for years and then just you know, getting annoyed that I don't have a clean towel to wipe my hands on.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

But also the um the Ikea towels, it's like just the next time you're IKEA, buy three packs of them. They're like, I don't know, seven bucks or eight, whatever for a ten pack of towels, just so you have forty of them. You know, like you have like a bunch. And then I will say when I was we were in Amsterdam a few years ago and um visiting Vincent's sister who lived there at the time, and they gave me for Christmas um like a gift card to this great cookware store there. Oh fun. And um, because we were traveling, I didn't want to get anything that was gonna be too complicated to uh put in the suitcase. And I ended up buying four or five of these like really cool kitchen towels. Like you know how I feel like in America, people love like a novelty towel. Yes, these are not novelty towels, they're like nice, it's a really nice weave, it's a cool pattern, it's a really good size. And so it was the sort of thing that I probably would have never bought myself because they were kind of expensive for being towels, but yeah, in this moment it was like, oh, that'll be great because I can just smoosh them into my suitcase.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

And yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:17

Now I love to have them because they're so nice to like dry your hands on. And so I kind of have like this stash of IKEA towels that I'll use for wiping down the counter, for cleaning, and I just like go through those like water. And then these ones are like the nice hand drying towels. But I change them out probably once a day.

SPEAKER_01 21:35

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I have now that we have like a washer dryer like like i that we that is just ours, I feel like that has changed my life a little bit in in those towel ways. 'Cause I feel like I used to just be like doing laundry is such a pain. If it's just like a whole load of towels, it seems crazy. But I I'm I'm easing out of it, but this is a good this is a good reminder to

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Um what else I wanted to I mean I was thinking about kitchen organization and the first thing that came to mind is like whenever I visit my dad uh and stepmom, they have like a big kitchen because they live, you know, in down in Charlotte and they're kind of in in a suburb situation, and it's like a it's a really a big kitchen by New York standards. Yeah. And um they don't cook that much and like less and less as they get older.

SPEAKER_02 22:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

And so there's stuff sort of like on one end is the pots, another end is the silverware, the utensils for cooking are in another part of the kitchen, the pantry's all the way around the corner. I feel like I'm like getting exercise whenever I cook in their kitchen because I'm like running around and going to and fro so much.

SPEAKER_02 22:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:43

That it has given me a deep, deep, deep appreciation for a galley kitchen. Yeah. And for learning to cook in New York apartments. Oh, definitely. You can kind of like stand in the middle and like easily access everything.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

I I have to say I love that too. I mean, it's fun to it's fun to have counter space. That's one thing I am jealous of in people with who have bigger kitchens where I'm like the idea of having, you know, some big space where you can really spread out and chop things and dump them in. Well, in some ways, that's a liability.

SPEAKER_00 23:15

It's true. It gets cluttered so easily. Like we have right now on our kitchen, it's like a you've seen it, it's a pretty big kitchen island. Yeah. And on, you know, when we first moved in here, I was like, oh my God, this is amazing. Look at all this space. And every time I want to make something where I need like if I'm like rolling something out, I'm like having to like clear all the clutter from the kitchen island because it just becomes this like magnet for stuff.

SPEAKER_01 23:41

Yeah, it it really does. Here's a question. How do you clean your cutting board?

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 23:47

And what cutting board do you have?

SPEAKER_00 23:49

I guess is maybe Oh, I have a collection of like wood cutting boards and then a few plastic ones. And then I just got this one like some kind of comp non-plastic but plastic type of cutting board, I think made made out of like vegetable fibers or something.

SPEAKER_02 24:05

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 24:06

Um but I just clean them under hot water with a sponge, and then I always make sure to dry them up right. And then every few, every few months I give them a good wax with uh for like a cutting board wax.

SPEAKER_01 24:20

Yeah. You stand them up like a wood cutting board, you stand it up just so it doesn't warp.

SPEAKER_00 24:25

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

Yeah. I think that's what I need to do because I had this great because I have like a really huge wooden cutting board and I feel like that's like my favorite thing in the kitchen. Just to be able to like chop a bunch of things at the same time and have it sort of all over the cutting board. And I can fit it in the sink and wash it, and usually that's what I do, but I the one I had recently cracked, and I was like, I think it's because I know, I think it's because I was washing it maybe too often. I would dry it off really carefully, but I think it was still something it was it was also funny because it had these little feet on it, so I think that was how that was making it the weight distribute differently or something. Anyway, but I'm trying to figure out what my method should be of cleaning this thing so that it doesn't crack, but it still feels really clean. I tried to get a cheap one and Tom and it arrived, and Tom was like, This is dumb. Like you should not like you use this like 8,000 times a day, and this doesn't look nice and it's kind of flimsy. And I was like, Okay, you're right. So then we got a nicer one. But I'm so I'm really trying not to crack it, but okay.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

Well, I think I don't know, that's always been a fantasy of mine to have like a giant cutting board that just like lives out on the counter, and every night you just kind of do a s lemon and salt scrub and maybe rub some oil into it or something, but it just stays there rather than the one that you have to like clean. But um, cleaning them is kind of an issue.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Yeah, cleaning them. That's basically this can fit in the sink. So I've have been scrubbing it down often, but I'm not doing I used to scrub it down like constantly, and now I'm trying to like do more of a wipe down and scrub it down less frequently, but I still want it to be really clean and I don't know. Is that what the guidance is?

SPEAKER_00 26:16

Like you shouldn't be deep cleaning them very often. Like what do you know what the what I don't the manufacturer's. Uh well the thing that I learned was The lemon and salt thing, I definitely do. That helps to get the odors of and some people are really picky about like they don't they have like a garlic cutting board because that can make everything, but I've actually never noticed that and I use garlic on all my cutting boards.

SPEAKER_01 26:40

I have noticed that, but I still refuse to have just a garlic only cutting board. Like sometimes I'll be like, oh, my toast sort of smells like garlic, but it happens. Yeah, yeah. Or worse things.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

Um but the main things being to always dry them off immediately and then that yeah, then to dry it upright. Yeah. Which I think that helps to prevent the warping and the cracking.

SPEAKER_01 27:02

I think that's what I'm gonna have to come up with some sort of system for is to find a place to put it upright.

SPEAKER_00 27:07

I have like a like a it's like a wax, but I think I can't remember the name of the manufacturer, but it's specifically for rubbing and like, you know, remoistening or treating salad bowl, like wood salad bowls and cutting boards and stuff and like wood utensils. And um it's just crazy how much the wood can like drink that stuff up. But um, so that what I'd always done is like every few months I'll be like, ooh, this is looking a little bit like furry with like the wood fibers. Yes, totally. Not with uh not with like bacteria or anything, but then um so I'll like rub all the wax on there. And then I saw on Instagram somebody was like putting their cutting board into a sheet pan and then literally like pouring mineral oil over it. So like almost almost submerging it in mineral oil and letting it sit that way overnight. And the way the wood tools, the wood cutting boards would just drink it up, there would be like not that much left in the pan the next morning.

SPEAKER_02 28:09

Really?

SPEAKER_00 28:09

And it gets like so thoroughly moistened. I want to try that. I haven't done it yet.

SPEAKER_01 28:14

That does sound kind of cool.

SPEAKER_00 28:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:16

I mean, we did get with this cutting board, we did get some mineral oil um to rub into it, and Tom's been doing that. Um because again, it's like me with the lotion. I'm like, I'm like, my hands aren't that dry, even though they're like extremely dry. I'm like, so it's better that he's that he's sort of drizzling some on more often than I would, but um, yeah, but I should I should do that.

SPEAKER_00 28:40

It makes them feel a lot better too. It makes them more pleasant to use. I will say that.

SPEAKER_01 28:46

Yeah, yeah. I mean a wood cutting board, I I actually think that is my favorite piece of kitchen equipment, like a really big one. Oh, so good.

SPEAKER_00 28:54

And the what one that's thick too and stays put.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Yes, yes. It's really nice. It's really nice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:02

Okay, so I just wanted I would just want to reflect on the fact that we're not going too deep into kitchen organization, but we did go deep into towels and cutting boards. So I hope people found uh there to be some valuable info in here. What are you making for dinner tonight?

SPEAKER_01 29:17

Um I'm actually going out to dinner. One of my college roommates is in town. Um so we're going to this Vietnamese place around the corner and just like catching up. Um kind of no fuss. Um, yeah, and I think the kids might have some leftover frozen pizza.

SPEAKER_00 29:35

Oh, fun. I bet they're excited about that.

SPEAKER_01 29:37

Yeah, they are excited about it. Um, but yeah, I need to. We're and we're going out of town, so it's like we're in sort of leftover use up mode. Yeah. So I was gonna like go buy some groceries and then I was like, nah.

SPEAKER_00 29:49

Nah. Don't need to.

SPEAKER_01 29:51

What are you making?

SPEAKER_00 29:53

So I got a slow cooker recently for a project.

SPEAKER_01 29:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

And um I just used it for the first time yesterday, and now I'm retesting a recipe. Have you do you have a slow cooker? I don't. You have a instant pot or some kind of combo cooker.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

Yeah, like a pressure cooker, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:10

Yeah. I actually have an instant pot too, and I had thought that you could just use that as I've used it many times, like the slow cooker function to cook beans and to make stock and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 30:21

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:21

Um, which and it works great. But then for this project, it's specific to slow cookers, and I learned that they work very differently. Like the slow cooker function on an instant pot works really differently from like a crock pot. Really? And I I don't know, I I have to I'm I'm in the beginning of this process, I'm gonna learn how. Yeah. But um, so I bought a slow cooker, which is they are not even that expensive. And my mom used to make crock pot meals all the time. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

I know a lot of people who are very dedicated to their slow cookers.

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Yeah. Oh yeah, and it is true, you just like dump stuff in there and then I I think that there's all kinds of ways that you can like amp it up if you want to like pre-cook some of the aromatics or like things and doing things at the end. But for this project, it's a lot of like dump the stuff in there and press go. But um I'm making like a red lentil and pumpkin soup that I'm gonna do over rice.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

That sounds like a good use for it. Because yeah, that is that is always my fear with slow cookers, is like I know there's like sometimes a saute function and stuff. It doesn't seem like that like you really can get that first stage of like sauteing stuff really done.

SPEAKER_00 31:29

No, and I had just made last night the rookie mistake of just thinking I could put some raw onion and raw garlic in there and then just let it simmer and it tastes like raw onion and raw garlic. Like there's a reason you gotta cook down those aromatics first. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:45

Yeah, I think that's right. I think that's right. It's really interesting how that how that works. But I guess it's yeah, I guess it's like what we were talking about with water. It's like you can't um it won't go above a certain temperature, I guess, when it's like submerged in some. Oh, exactly. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. So it just never really breaks down in the same way.

SPEAKER_00 32:04

Yeah, or it get or caramelizes.

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Yeah, yeah. Huh. But but yeah, is this like in a sort of curry direction or is it like the pumpkin?

SPEAKER_00 32:14

A little bit. Yeah, it's yeah, I guess it's in the curry direction. There's good there's some of those spices in there.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Hmm. Yeah. Because I was gonna say that that would be a cool instance. Is it uh now I'm gonna forget what it's called? Is it called a chonk or something where you where you heat up oil and you put spices in and then you add that to like your slow cook thing at the very end. Yes. Or at a tonka, I think that's it. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'm sure there's a million words for it, and mine's probably wrong. But yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:46

I don't think so. Oh, okay, good. But um, yeah, I should try that here. That would be good.

SPEAKER_01 32:51

Yeah, that would be interesting. Just because yeah, I I hate slow cooker recipes or pressure cooker recipes that are like just saute some stuff first, because I'm like, if I'm sauteing it, then I'm not transferring it into a I'm just gonna make it in a yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 33:04

It's like not actually that hard to make soup.

SPEAKER_01 33:07

Right, right. And then I'm like, yeah, you just turn it on, turn it on low on your stove or stick it in the oven or whatever. Yeah. Huh. Oh, well that will be kind of fun to experiment with though. I'm sure I'm sure there are some things that just don't require sauteing in the same way that like what you're saying, they sort of dump things in recipe that would work just just great in there.

SPEAKER_00 33:27

Yeah, and I'm I mean, in this instance, I'm just gonna replace that stuff with like onion powder and garlic powder, which are two spices that for years I never cooked with, and then recently I've been like, oh, actually these are kind of good. And they add something that I don't know how to, you know, it's it's hard to recreate that specific flavor.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

It's so funny you say that because I was putting um, you know how I've been this is not self-promotion, but it sounds like it is. I was put redoing all those things on my Substack. I was I've been posting old writing from my blog that's like from 2016 and 2017 onto my Substack site because I have nothing on it. And um one of the things I had scheduled for later this week is this thing about garlic powder, because I do find garlic powder to be so fascinating. Everyone talks a lot of trash about garlic powder and onion powder, but they're really very good.

SPEAKER_00 34:17

Yeah, I think there's been a little bit of a pendulum swing.

SPEAKER_01 34:20

I think there probably has. Yeah. Well, especially with like TikTok and stuff. I feel like people just throw like handfuls of spices and stuff and everything, and it's just part of the part of the thing.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

And it's good. Yeah. It makes stuff taste like fast food to me. It's like it's like a very uh I don't know, it feels like a sort of a commercial taste.

SPEAKER_01 34:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, and not necessarily in a bad way. There's like a sort of warmth to it.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

Yeah. Yeah, no, not in a bad way at all. It it tastes good. It's like if you make like ranch dressing or something, or exactly it's like this recipe for uh um tatsiki that was like a fast or lazy tziki that I made where it's like a big ol' spoonful of garlic powder, a big ol' spoonful of onion powder, like this is good.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

Yeah, yeah. Especially in those cases, because like raw garlic and raw onion are really strong. Yeah. So sometimes you just don't want to have the bite of that. You want to have like the flavor but not the punch. Well, enjoy um yeah, your experimentations.

SPEAKER_00 35:23

I will. And um enjoy your Thai food and meeting up with a friend.

SPEAKER_01 35:28

Thanks. Yeah, okay. We'll talk to you. Talk to you next week. Okay, sounds good. Bye.