Water Is the Best Ingredient

Welcome to Salt Pig! This week, we're celebrating the glory of tap water. Ellie and Lukas break down the numerous ways that water is one of the most useful ingredients in our cooking and helpful tool in the kitchen—from controlling temperature in a pan and dispersing flavor, to making the purest-tasting soups, risottos, and more. Plus, catch Ellie’s quick lemon spaghetti and Lukas’ hot take on leftover pasta. Join us, and if you enjoy — please like and subscribe!

Discussed in this episode:

• Via Carota's Insalata Verde 
• Does Pasta Water Thicken the Sauce? by Nik Sharma
• Gabrielle Hamilton's Endive Salad in the Puntarelle Style

Instagram | Substack

Transcript

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SPEAKER_02 0:02

Welcome to Salt Pig. We are two cookbook writers chatting about the ups and downs of actual home kitchen life. Lucas, what are we talking about this week?

SPEAKER_01 0:11

This week we are talking about our favorite free ingredient, which is water. And it's kind of um it's kind of fascinating how versatile it is and how um transformative it is in our cooking. And so we dig deep into pasta and making dressings into sauces and things. And it's kind of a fun episode. I actually learned a lot talking with you about this.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

I did too. I didn't realize ice was such a prevalent ingredient in like more dishes than I thought. So tune in for that. You can find new and old episodes wherever you listen to podcasts, and be sure to check us out on Substack2 at saltpig.substack.com where you can sign up for the Chomp, which is our monthly newsletter, which went out on March 6th. I guess the day that we're recording this, it came out this morning. But um, it only comes out once a month, so make sure you subscribe on Substack, it's free, and you'll get our newsletter once a month, and it's pretty fun.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

It's fun, and then you'll get also notification every time a new episode comes out. You'll get our show notes. We try to keep it light and easy, fun stuff only.

SPEAKER_02 1:18

Yeah. Oh, and this month's we have Lucas's more official recipe for sourdough discard crepes, which I tried, which were much better than the straight sourdough discard version that I did.

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Discard into a hot pan. Yeah. I would have been so excited if that did work, though.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

I mean, it worked well enough. But yeah, your version's infinitely better. I was kind of shocked actually how much of a difference, like the egg seems to just carry. Oh, yeah. Turns it into a crepe. Yeah. Turns it into a crepe. So um definitely look out for that. And I'm sure if you sign up even now, you could probably access our old.

SPEAKER_01 1:54

Yeah, you'll see it on the on the homepage for that link.

SPEAKER_02 1:56

Any sourdough heads out there, that's definitely worth a try.

SPEAKER_01 1:59

All right, well, let's get started.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

I know we have a really good episode today, but I wanted to start off. We've been getting some really excellent comments from listeners, and we just got a comment on our last episode, the recipe episode, and I just thought she had some really good points, so I just wanted to mention them. Um her name is Becky, and she uses recipes she said nearly 100% of the time. And two points that she brought up, which I thought were really interesting, is one using recipes for her is almost a way of dealing with mental load of of like cooking for a household. Sounds like she has children, and sounds like she's doing like cooking three meals a day, like over and over and over again as six days a week, homemade. Six days a week.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

I think it's actually a lot of people.

SPEAKER_02 2:50

It's it's a lot of people. That's certainly what we do. I mean, maybe even more than that in a way.

SPEAKER_01 2:55

Um Yeah, you get kind of distorted uh living in New York because people do take out and eat out so often, but yeah, most people cook all their food.

SPEAKER_02 3:03

Oh yeah. So she I thought that was a really um a really nice and interesting point. Because I think what I was curious about is what recipes she's using, obviously, because I think there are some recipes which really do help with that mental load. They do take some of the pressure off and do some of the thinking for you and all of that. So Becky, if you hear this, let us know which recipes, like if you have some great cookbook recommendation. I'd be I'd be interested what sort of recipes are doing that for you. Then she was also talking about how recipes enable her to cook sort of authentic dishes from other cuisines, and that is absolutely true. Like there's I would say it's that and baking for me, where I'm like, I really want a recipe to lead me there because I don't know how to get there on my own. Um or the way I'm gonna get there is gonna be my version, but you really want someone else's version in those cases for me. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:57

And I feel like that brings up kind of a good point too, where you started that episode saying like recipes are actually a pretty recent invention in terms of how we cook. And in some ways, they are a response and a symptom of how we all live now, which is uh, you know, everybody's working. I feel like raising kids is probably more stressful than it's ever been, at least for I don't know, probably everywhere. But the recipe comes in to help it helps you sort out your shopping list, it helps you to sort up your um the time you're gonna spend in the kitchen. It just kind of like plugs into the logistics of our really busy contemporary lives. Yes. Um and I had not really thought about recipes that way, even though it makes it like so obvious when it's stated, but like I thought that was kind of an interesting way of reframing this purpose and utility of a recipe.

SPEAKER_02 4:45

Yes. And also and the global perspective, too, in that that's a contemporary idea too, in that I think we were saying, you know, people used to just have some food and that would be the food that they'd cook, and that was a different time. And now people are much more exposed to different cultures, are much more curious about like global flavors and all these things, and in order to be able to execute that, you do need some road gap or some exposure to it. And you know, we live in New York City, so we can be exposed to some of those flavors without actually having to cook them ourselves. But for a lot of people who might not have like, say, a Malaysian restaurant in their neighborhood, cookbooks are are the way to that. So I think I think that was a really good point. So thanks, Becky.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Yeah, thank you, Becky.

SPEAKER_02 5:30

But today's episode we're talking about water as one of the most important ingredients in cooking. And um and I had this I really didn't plan this, but I was cooking I was cooking something recently, and then water kind of saved the day. So I thought I'd just um launch right into it. Yeah, so I made some beans in the pressure cooker, which I do like almost every week, and half of the beans I like marinate with like lemon zest, lemon juice, olive oil, and put like celery and scallions in them, and that's the kids eat those like constantly. So that's always what I'm doing with beans almost every week. But I usually save like some of them because I have like this one container that I make those beans in and they can't all fit in there. So I usually save some of the beans and then the bean broth, of course. Rather than getting a larger container, but yeah, I can't get a larger container, that would be too practical. So um so yeah, so half of the beans, and it's like a whole pound. So it's it is or maybe even two pounds, those like Goya bags. Anyway, it's a lot of beans. So usually I'll like make a soup or whatever. Anyway, I had these beans and I was like, oh, for dinner I'm just gonna make like a more of like a stew, which I never really do. So I had half, or like you know, some beans and the bean broth, and I was like, I'll saute an onion and some garlic, and I thought it would be kind of fun. I had some prosciutto in the freezer, so I like cut up a little bit of prosciutto. I was going for like a sort of beans and greens vibe, sauteed all that, added the beans in the broth, added some kale, added some better than bouillon. It was all looking like it was gonna be really delicious, and then I tasted it and it was so salty.

SPEAKER_01 7:10

Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

I had just added too much better than bouillon. I salted the beans in the water, which I sort of forgot about. Maybe I was a little overzealous salting all the onions and stuff, and also prosciutto is so dang salty. This was probably only like a quarter pound, not even. It was like a couple slices. So it was just a salt bomb, and I it was like sort of an edible inedible. So I was like, now what? I tried putting lemon juice in it, which I thought was gonna really help. It helped a little bit, it didn't help enough.

SPEAKER_01 7:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 7:41

Um so then I basically just turned it into a soup by adding a tremendous amount of water. Oh, there you go. It fixed it. And I was like, water to the rescue. I was like, I just needed to add literally like it was so salty, I needed to add like probably like three cups of water. And then I was like, now this tastes great.

SPEAKER_01 7:58

And we've got a nice soup, yeah. Yeah. Have you ever tried so I know we're talking about water, but another trick when stuff like that is to well uh dairy. Yeah, yogurt or dairy, but also just throwing in a peeled potato.

SPEAKER_02 8:10

Oh, I've heard about that.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

The potato somehow s soaks up the salt or I don't I don't know if it soaks up the salt or just absorbs stuff.

SPEAKER_02 8:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:20

Results in lower salt.

SPEAKER_02 8:22

Oh, I'll have to try that next time.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

I did that once and it actually worked really well.

SPEAKER_02 8:27

Really? Okay. Interesting. Like a chopped-up potato?

SPEAKER_01 8:30

I just did a whole one, so you can fish it back out.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

Um interesting.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

Yeah. And actually, I don't even think I fished it. I'm trying to remember, maybe I just became part of the soup, but the idea was you stick it in there and it operates as some kind of sponge and soaks up the salt, and I don't know. I think that's one of those old timey things.

SPEAKER_02 8:48

Well if it works. I was thinking also, I was like, I can add some yogurt to this, but I that wasn't really the direction I was going in. I was like, no, prosciutto and yogurt sound kind of weird. So yeah, so water really, I was like this little trick. And it's yeah, it wasn't exactly what I wanted it to be, but it fixed the problem. So I'll take that.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

There was a time when I sort of had this conviction that rather than using like a canned or a boxed broth or even using now I'm a big fan of like better than bouillon paste, but like at the time I wasn't. I would I believed that like water was a better ingredient to use in soups and risottos and stews than broth if it wasn't gonna be like a good clean tasting homemade one.

SPEAKER_02 9:31

I could see that.

SPEAKER_01 9:32

And it is kind of crazy, like I feel like if you have sort of a weak broth, you're way better off using water. Yes. Because like then you're not doing anything to sort of like muddy the flavors here. You're preserving all the flavor that you've been building in the dish, and the water is just there to carry it.

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Yes, that's exactly right. And I think that's often where like water's best role is it helps carry other flavors and often like from a textural point of view it really can help thin things out or oh yeah, you know, all that, but it's it's it's exactly what you said. It's using the flavors that you already have. Like I know with like vegetable soups, sometimes having water with it, you get this really clean vegetable flavor, especially like a blended, if you're making like a blended pea soup or something. Yes. Of course you could put in broth and it will be delicious, but it there's something really nice about like this pure pea flavor that you would have with water and maybe like an herb. You can like really pick your flavors a little bit because broth can sometimes just it adds a lot of backbone.

SPEAKER_01 10:40

Like I think of broth as being like this is the backbone of the dish, and sometimes it's like it can be too much.

SPEAKER_02 10:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

When when the flavors are delicate. And like in risotto, I actually think in risotto water is better than using broth, even if you've got like really nice homemade broth. Interesting. Because the rice has this really beautiful, delicate flavor, and when you sweat the onions, they have this kind of delicate sweet flavor. If you use anything else in there, like the everything about risotto is actually quite delicate. Yes. And even like the cheese in the end. And so broth is just sometimes a little bit too too heavy for for a dish like that.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

Yeah. And sometimes you don't want to have like having six different flavors isn't better than having two really distinct ones or three different distinct ones. Especially in that case with like Parmesan is such a strong flavor, and I don't know, there's you don't want to have too much competition.

SPEAKER_01 11:29

Right. And then Parmesan is one of those things too. It is such it's such a potent cheese that if in something like risotto, if you're using like a really strong flavored broth, you're gonna need kind of a lot of cheese so that the cheese can do its thing, but when you use water or a really light broth, you don't actually need that much in order to get the flavor to be balanced.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

That's really interesting. I believe that.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

I was thinking while we were brainstorming this episode, I was thinking most things are made primarily of water, and like cooking in some ways is about manipulating water as this sort of like elemental component of all these ingredients. So like when you're cooking vegetables, you're cooking the water out of them in order to concentrate their flavors. You're like cooking the water in order to like uh manipulate the texture of them. When you're um making a soup, you're adding in the form of broth or liquid or whatever. You're basically like adding water in order to carry flavor and to extend flavor into other parts of the dish. And and in that way, it's like water is this like really handy and transformative ingredient, but it's also just the thing that is the common thread of every part of the dish that you're making.

SPEAKER_02 12:41

Right. It's already in your ingredient list, so it's like you can manipulate that, you can fine-tune that a little.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

Yeah, and then like shelf-stable things like beans and pasta, they are shelf-stable because the water's been removed, and the process of cooking them is re-injecting them with water.

SPEAKER_02 12:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 12:56

Uh, and bringing them back to life.

SPEAKER_02 12:58

Yes. And I was gonna that brings me to some of my favorite water usages, which is like the water that's left behind after cooking something. So pasta water, bean broth. But I was thinking too, with like obviously pasta water is such an amazing ingredient in the kitchen, and it's so necessary to make certain dishes, and there's kind of no good alternative to it. You know, like the probably the dish I use the most pasta water with is when I make lemon spaghetti for the kids. I mean, we all eat it, not just for the kids. Um but they really like it. And it's it's one of those dead simple recipes where you're like, it's lemon zest, it's lemon juice, it's parmesan, and it's pasta and pasta water. I don't think there's even oh, and I guess butter. I use some butter. But it's that pasta water because it's been rehydrating the pasta, because it's become a little starchy, because you add a little salt, it becomes, yeah, this magical ingredient that really turns these again, kind of delicate but also really bright flavors and carries them over an entire dish. Whereas if you had this plate of pasta and you just put some lemon juice and some lemon zest on it and some cheese, you'd have these pockets that are like kind of overwhelmingly flavored. It wouldn't it wouldn't all come together, and there's something so magical about that particular water treatment that turns all those disparate ingredients into this like magical glue. Yeah. It really makes the whole dish, and it's um and it's can you walk us through how you make this dish?

SPEAKER_01 14:36

I don't think I've ever made lemon spaghetti actually.

SPEAKER_02 14:39

Oh, really? Oh gosh. I actually just started making it a couple years ago, and the kids are obsessed with it. I melt some butter, like quite a bit of butter for like a pound of pasta, like at least four tablespoons, but you could do a whole stick and it would easily in a way easily. Yes, totally. Um then you cook some spaghetti in some salted water. While the spaghetti's cooking, zest a lemon into the butter. Once the butter's melted, it doesn't need to have the flame on underneath. You can put the lemon juice in the water.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Browning it or anything, you're just leaving it.

SPEAKER_02 15:12

You're just literally melting it. Grating a whole zest of a lemon into the butter, squeezing at least half of the lemon, depending on the size, I'd start with half. Then you, once the pasta's cooked, you just pull the pasta over like with tongs or a spider. You don't need to drain it because you want to keep all that pasta water in the pot. And once the spaghetti is in that delicious butter, lemon juice, lemon zest mixture. I also like to add some pepper to the butter to like bloom it a little bit. Once you add that pasta in, then you just start putting, you know, like a half cup of pasta water in at a time and on a really low flame and just cooking that pasta if you pull it a little early so it's not a hundred percent done.

SPEAKER_01 15:56

Right. It finishes cooking with the addition of this water, okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:00

Exactly. And then at that point, while you're adding the pasta water, adding some grated Parmesan cheese. I don't like to shred it because I feel like the texture can get kind of funky. Grated like often will incorporate into the pasta water a little bit better.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

Grated meaning I always get confused about this, but this means it's sort of like crumbly rather than shards. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:20

Exactly. Not the shards.

SPEAKER_01 16:21

And or or microplaned.

SPEAKER_02 16:24

I feel like microplanes sometimes I think that would totally work, but I've gotten really into just having like store-bought like not like shelf stable parmesan cheese, but store-bought grated Parmesan cheese that's just like it's kind of like dust. Yeah. And it does really incorporate well. Whereas sometimes I feel like the shreds, even microplanes, will scatter in a funny way and clump up.

SPEAKER_01 16:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:51

Interesting. But I'm sure it would work. But anyway, you add some cheese, you keep adding pasta water, you keep stirring it all together on this low flame, and then it just turns into this amazing dish. And once the pasta's cooked, then you're done. It's nice to have like some parsley if you have it kicking around, but Okay. I don't even usually do that.

SPEAKER_01 17:08

Uh sorry, this is a dumb question, and because this I know this is a very like well-known dish, but is it it's the lemoniness is it's not too lemony, is what I'm asking.

SPEAKER_02 17:17

It's not too lemony, and and I think that's because you use so much butter. Oh, okay. So it's it's like cheese, I imagine, offset. And the cheese. All that acidity is balanced by all that fat. And it's very delicious. And the lemon zest is vital, obviously. And then if you want it to be more lemony, you can add, you know, another half a lemon. I I like it lemony, but it can get out of whack if you you know overdo it. Yeah, if you overdo it.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

I mean, that's the thing about pasta. Like I know that this is like a pretty well-established tenet of cooking now, but pasta um finishing with the water is so essential in order to get the right texture. And there's something about like having your sauce in a skillet, the pasta in the pot, transferring the noodles directly from the cooking water into the skillet, dripping, and then just continuing to add like I I think a lot of people don't realize how much water you can actually add to it. Right. Um, it's it's not just like a splash, but it's like, as you're saying, like a half cup at a time.

SPEAKER_02 18:18

Yeah. Yeah. And it will keep drinking it up too. Yes. I mean, it will just like, you know, we'll all I'll get it to a point where it's cooked and it's saucy and I love the texture, and we'll all start eating. And then when I come back to like have seconds, inevitably it's kind of dry. So then you can kind of just like reheat it with some more pasta water and bring it back to life.

SPEAKER_01 18:38

I gotta say, too, this is probably controversial or unorthodox for the Italians that might be listening, but I think leftover pasta is better than the day of pasta. Really? And it's exactly that where you like and I don't save the pasta water. I'll just use like hot tap water.

SPEAKER_03 18:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

But you reheat it in the skillet and then just add keep adding water until it like becomes like glossy and loose and delicious looking. And then you might have to reseason it a little bit with some cheese or some salt or a little bit of lemon zest or something, but the way the pasta just like absorbs all that flavor, it's just oh my god, it's the best treat. Even like leftover carbonar or something, with it is um I believe it. You would think that that's like only made to order is actually really good the next day.

SPEAKER_02 19:21

I bet it's really good the next day. And I'll and it's not as good when you just pop it in the microwave, which is often what I do, and then it gets like sort of gummy, and sometimes if you do it for too long, it really will like turn into this like it become sort of rigid, you know. So don't recommend that. But it's true. If you if you're willing to like get out a skillet, which is an ask, then yeah. I thought you were gonna say that you save the pasta water, which would really be I thought that would really be good. Yeah. No, no.

SPEAKER_01 19:52

And you know, I re I remember reading something recently, I think it was Nick Sharma, who sort of take has a scientific approach to cooking. I think the thing that he investigated with this is if the pasta water is actually necessary in order to do the like help emulsify the sauce. And what he found is that it doesn't actually have to be pasta water, it can be just regular water because there's still starch in the noodles. So it's not like the the starch in the water is actually quite like low. So if you dump the pasta water, don't worry about it, just use tap water.

SPEAKER_02 20:25

Yeah. In fact, I think I was reading something like that too, was it I think it was Samine Nostrat where she was saying the same thing. She'll use pasta water up to a certain point, but then sometimes it will throw off the seasoning, like it will start to get too salty because the pasta water is salted. So she'll do that to a certain point and then she'll just start adding plain water because she doesn't want to upset that. So I thought that was a really good tip. Yeah. She had another tip about water that I thought I'd mention, which brought up a whole other aspect of the benefits of water, which is she has this salad dressing recipe. It's like a pretty standard recipe, and we can link to it for like a vinaigrette. But she adds a little water to it. Oh, yeah. And I thought that was really smart, and it made me think a lot of great dressings and sauces have water added to them, and that's like a very vital part of the recipe, both texturally, but also sometimes, especially in a dressing, you're talking about some really intense flavors. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:28

And it opens everything up.

SPEAKER_02 21:30

Yeah, it opens everything up and it makes it so that you're not like gonna be blasted by flavors. Like sometimes when you make like a vinaigrette, you're like, this is good, but it's kind of too much. Like even on a salad, it might kind of be too much. And if you can just take it down, just dial it down a tiny bit via a little splash of water, it can really make it more mild and more palatable, basically.

SPEAKER_01 21:53

Yeah. Did you ever see um Gabrielle Hamilton herb at prune in the prune cookbook? There's this Esquerrol salad that oh she like crushed ice is an ingredient in the salad.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

Really?

SPEAKER_01 22:08

And we made it one time. I used to have this cookbook club where we would choose a cookbook and then like work the choose the recipes and I'll make them and talk about them over the meal. And um I was like, that's gotta be an error. The crushed ice, there's no way that like crushed ice would go in because you'd go to such freaking pains in order to get the lettuce dry. The idea of like then adding water to the I'm like, this is gonna be a disaster. But it was incredible.

SPEAKER_02 22:33

I can imagine it's does it emulsify, is it is it for an emulsification, like an easier emulsification?

SPEAKER_01 22:39

I want to oh god, now it's it's been years since we did this, but I want to say it was like the the ice was like in the lettuce, like before you add, or maybe like mixed into the dressing or something, but like the ice chunks were in the salad. I mean I really hope I'm not wrong about this.

SPEAKER_02 22:56

Well, let's let's look it up.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

We'll validate it and put it in the shape.

SPEAKER_02 23:00

That makes that I I can see that. And it reminds me of, you know, in certain Korean dishes, um like those these cold noodle dishes, they'll literally be served with ice on them, which is appealing both because it cools the noodles like way down and keeps them cold. But also I think similarly, it's slowly diluting the flavor so that they don't so that they're not too strong.

SPEAKER_01 23:23

And I think that's like And you end up with something you can like slurp up at the end, whereas beforehand it would have been too intense to drink on as well.

SPEAKER_02 23:29

That's right. That's right. That's right. I think that's yeah, I think that's pretty compelling.

SPEAKER_01 23:34

Yeah. I mean, I sorry, just to keep going on like the ways we use water. Yeah. One of my favorite things for like is basically making a sauce of something that's too thick. So like tahini. You could just like whisk water into tahini, suddenly you have a tahini drizzle that um you can use kind of as a dressing or as a dip or something. Same thing with yogurt. I'll like I and even yogurt is one of those things too. You know, when like yogurt sits and it's sort of like the whey starts to separate and you have to like beat it all back together in order to make it kind of creamy. I know that you you were mentioning uh before that sometimes you'll just like replace the whey with water, and I'm curious to hear that. But like I remember learning, and I think this was from David Tannis, that like whisking water into yogurt actually just like it's kind of what we're talking about. It opens up all the flavor of the yogurt. You know how sometimes like yogurt, like that's just like a little too intense intense, and then the water just makes it smooth and much more palatable.

SPEAKER_03 24:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

And it gives this this like light, fluffy, silky texture too. Yes. So even if I'm just like eating yogurt on its own, sometimes I'll do that because it just makes it like less intense. But especially if you like spread it over a place. So I I love the thing where you like smear yogurt on a plate and put a bunch of roasted vegetables on top and stuff. Delicious. That's a great way to um turn yogurt into something kind of different.

SPEAKER_02 24:58

Oh yeah. And it's um yeah, it's interesting how how it can add this cleanness or like a purity aspect. You can kind of add this quality to things.

SPEAKER_01 25:09

Well, I and I mean similar to what I we were saying before, I feel like you're adding water back into these in a way, you know, I don't know with yogurt how long it's somewhere down the line it was more water than it is now. And by putting water in, you're sort of like reconstituting it in some way.

SPEAKER_02 25:25

Yes. Yes. I think that's I think that's really true. It's also interesting. I mean, I thought I'd just note like, and at some point maybe we'll have some sort of bean broth episode, it seems like, where everyone's everyone's clamoring for it, I'm sure. Um but one quick mention is aquafaba, which I feel like the sort of ultimate bean water, which is just the cooking liquid, particularly of chickpeas, and it has such sort of magical qualities that's turned into this like vegan superfood because you can like whip it, it will it will grow in volume in this way that's almost like sort of meringues, or I don't know if you've played around with it. I haven't really.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

I only have a few times, but it does, it's like egg whites.

SPEAKER_02 26:11

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:12

So and it's kind of like uh considered a vegan um version of of egg whites.

SPEAKER_02 26:17

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

Which is very cool.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Yeah, super cool.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

Are you picky about your drinking water?

SPEAKER_02 26:23

No. Well, no. I love a New York City tap experience.

SPEAKER_01 26:29

Um New Yorkers are so proud of their tap water. I am very proud of it.

SPEAKER_02 26:34

I am very proud of it. And having lived in a couple other places where the tap water is really subpar, I don't want to call out any particular cities, but um but yeah, Philadelphia, I guess I feel like I have to call that out. Um it's it just I never got used to I went to college there and I just never got used to it. It just was always terrible. And you could like put it through a Brita and do all the stuff, it just didn't matter. It was still terrible.

SPEAKER_01 26:57

So interesting. Yeah. I had the have the same thing where I like I didn't think I really cared about the taste. I'm like, water tastes like water, it's fine, I'm not picky. And then visiting a friend up in Connecticut, and I was like, what is this? I was like, and I don't even think I would want to cook with it, to be honest. But also then if you ever have the opportunity to like splurge on a really nice bottle of water when you're out at a restaurant, it is kind of uh noticeable the difference in the flavor. Really? I feel like it's flavor, but in my mind, it's kind of texture, it just feels like this really indulgent, luxurious thing that you're drinking. And it I'm sure I'm just completely manipulated by the packaging and stuff, but I know there are a lot of people who are very, very picky about their water.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

I know. Part of me I just hate I'm like the idea of paying money for water, like really grates on me. Big surprise. And the like waste of bottles and all that junk.

SPEAKER_01 27:52

In preparing for this episode too, I was thinking about how even when you add wet ingredients like tomatoes to a dish of where you like say sauteing, some garlic or sauteing, some ginger or aromatics, you are essentially introducing water to a dish and like allowing those flavors to basically like spread and be carried throughout the dish.

SPEAKER_02 28:14

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 28:15

And then I was also sorry, this is now just turning into some weird factoids, but one of the things with water as a cooking method is you can't ever burn anything in water because it won't get above boiling temperature.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

Right. It's such a rescue, like I have my my kettle, like a electric kettle right next to the stovetop, and I use it for cooking constantly. Because it's true, like if you're cooking something and it's like on the edge of going too far, you just literally like add a splash of water. Yeah. Stops that problem, and if you can then cook it off and sort of return to what you were doing or carry on. If it's just a little bit, it will kind of evaporate. But it's such a handy way of like keeping control over the the temperature of things and the speed with which they're cooking.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

Yeah, it's like a a lever you can pull.

SPEAKER_02 29:04

Yeah. And it's great like like in a pan sauce or anything like that. Again, what we're saying is like there's so many intense flavors. Like if you have like a if you like cook some chicken in a pan and there's all this delicious fond in the bottom of the pan, you really don't need to add broth. You don't need to add flavor. You just need to pick up those elements and and and sort of increase the volume of them so that you can pour it uh back on your chicken. So it's such a nice way to make a pan sauce, is just again, using water. Like you can saute some garlic in it, you can add some other particular flavors if you want, but like it's always interesting to just add more water. Like you don't want to have it be a salt bomb, or you don't want to have all the lemon juice or wine that you're putting in to be the you have to find that balance, and often that's like a splash from the kettle. Yeah. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

Yeah, totally. And like I think this is the reason soup kitchens exist, is like water can be used to like stretch food and feed more people.

SPEAKER_02 30:06

For sure.

SPEAKER_01 30:07

It's like it's the the free ingredient that I don't know, multiplies multiplies volume.

SPEAKER_02 30:13

Yeah, yeah. And and often can like really um really help help something become what it's meant to be. Like my beans.

SPEAKER_03 30:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:24

What are you making for dinner tonight? Or eating for dinner tonight. It's a Friday, so it's a Friday.

SPEAKER_02 30:31

It could be the night off, but I have this leftover. I cooked some pork chops last night. Um so I have a leftover pork chop. So I was going to slice it really thin and then make like a Vietnamese style, like cook some rice noodles, shred some veggies, I have some cilantro, um like cukes and trying to think of what else I have kicking around. And then make like a yummy fish sauce, lime juice dressing, which also very importantly includes water. Water, okay. Because it's otherwise it's I think it's like what I usually do is like one part fish sauce, one part lime juice, one part water, and then some sugar to taste, which is kind of important to help bring it all together, and like some garlic. But just making like that sort of porrable, you know, everyone can have a spoonful or two over their rice noodles. No oil. Okay. Yeah, yeah. And it's um yeah, so I think it will be pretty good. Um and everyone thinks rice noodles are kind of fun.

SPEAKER_01 31:34

And this is a cold dish or a hot dish or like a room temperature.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

Room temperature dish. Yeah. I might cook some tofu. The kids were sort of on the fence about the pork chops, so I might cook some tofu to have to bring them into it.

SPEAKER_01 31:47

But Yum, that sounds really good.

SPEAKER_02 31:49

Yeah, yeah, I think it does sound kind of fun. Those flavors are a nice change. What are you making?

SPEAKER_01 31:53

Yeah, that's especially this time of year. Um, we're going out to dinner tonight. My brother is visiting, so we've taken him out and we're going to have you been to Shuket. Yes. This I I really I'm a fan of it, and I really love the chef Aisha, who is behind that restaurant in Shuka in New York, and she's really been blowing up and she's always on the Today Show and stuff. That's Susan. If you can hear Susan in the background.

SPEAKER_02 32:18

Oh yeah. She's like, I love it too.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Yeah, exactly. It's really good. It's sort of like pan Middle Eastern like dips, and her her whole thing is like rip and dip, so it's a bunch of these like fresh made breads and then all these delicious dips, and so you kind of eat that one.

SPEAKER_02 32:36

All these little small plates. It's so fun to do that with with other people too, if you have like more than just a one person.

SPEAKER_01 32:43

Yeah, you definitely want a crew. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:45

That'll be great. Yeah. What a treat.

SPEAKER_01 32:47

Enjoy cooking with your water, our free ingredients, and uh have a good weekend.

SPEAKER_02 32:51

You too. Have fun with your brother. Thank you. Okay, talk to you soon. Bye. Bye.